Does anybody know the Thatcham rating of the security system fitted to the MG 'Z' range?

Be interested to know the rating with and without the Volumetric system.

The Thatcham site does not list the MG models nor does the new 'Vehicle Security Listing' published February 2002.

Also, anybody got any suggestions on which model to upgrade the fitted system to Thatcham Class 1? (If it isn't that already)

Phil

Hi Phil
I don't think the Lucas 5AS Alarm (As on ZR & ZS) system has ever been Thatcham Approved, I don't know why...??? ???

You'd have thought with the Zeds, they would have put a decent alarm system on top of the list....oh well never mind:)

Thanks Dave,

At least now I know the manufacturer and model number. I'll dig a bit further to see what else I can find out about that model.

Looks like I'll have to spend a few extra £££'s to upgrade it when my 'R' gets delivered.

Phil

Not wanting to worry folk or anything, but i would upgrade ur factory alarm ASAP as there have been a large amount of Z cars goin missing shall we say. Apparently, there is a very easy way to short the alarm out. Im not goin to post it on the forum for obvious reasons, but it is worrying!

I found this out from a family member who works for MGR in the electrical engineering hub who deal with faults/problems.

So fellas, watch out!

Thanks Don

I would urge anybody with a decent motor to upgrade the factory alarm with a decent Cat 1 system if they want to keep their pride & joy

A Cat 1 system needn't cost much more than £350 and could be fitted in a day =P

I would recommend Clifford as they are way ahead of the others IMO. They have a lot of very good features on there range of alarms- a link to your PC is just one. Toad are also very good- those are the two i would look at.

Check out http://www.clifford.co.uk/home.html for further info :)

The Dealer search works well :D

http://www.carshoptaunton.co.uk/home.htm comes highly reccomended =P

Dave,

Just out of interest, my ZT has the volumetric alarm option added to it. You've mentioned here about the alarm system in the R/S, but what about the T. Any ideas what make it is, especially the volumetric alarm system. The reason I ask is because when I insured it, the insurance company wanted to know what make the volumetric bit was. I said I didn't know, so they wouldn't give any discount for the added security.

Would be useful if I could tell them what it is so I can get the insurance a bit cheaper... :D

The saga continues ...

I phoned Rover today to try to get more info on the security system. Here is what I found out:

First Rover said the security system fitted to all the 'Z' series is Thatcham category 2 compliant.

I phoned Thatcham and they said it was not compliant because it had not been tested. This seemed a reasonable statement to me as 'The Vehicle Security National Listing' (their bible) does not list any MG apart from the MGF.

I phoned Rover back and told them what Thatcham had said. They seemed to take it quite seriously as they took my details so they could ring me back when they had investigated. And they did ring back ... stating that all the MGZ models had been submitted and tested by Thatcham, but they had not updated their list yet. They are sure it is Category 2 compliant.

So there we are. Those of us who have (or are getting) an MGZ, have category 2 security.

But we can't ignore what Don25 says about how easy it is to get past! Perhaps Don could tip Thatcham off to how easy it is to get past an alarm they are about to certify as category 2

@Don25 Can you tell us (without posting how its done) if we knew how it was done, could we do anything to stop it?

@Nick The volumetric part of your alarm is the ultrasonic protection inside the vehicle. With perimetric only protection, the alarm only sounds if the doors, bonnet or boot are opened. With volumetric the alarm will sound if there is any movement inside the car.

Hope this info is of help.

I think I'll get a 2>1 upgrade asap.

Phil

Thanks for your perseverence on this subject, Phil. It is most interesting what MGR had to say, isn't it?

Please, Don, by all means, tell Thatcham how the immobiliser can be overcome....this is slightly worrying???

Nick, I thought the 75/ZT Alarm system was indeed Thatcham approved...

I think [IIRC!] the 75 Alarm system is a Valeo system [The remote keys bear the Valeo name??]....I'll check later:eyes

Phil,

I cant say without posting, but unfortunately the car thiefing scum are unstoppable in this case as what they do is unpreventable! The only way to combat it is (so ive been told) is to replace the factory set up or have another one running over the top of it (as i have)as there scam doesnt work on a non rover system.

what i can say is that once the alarm is defeated, they bypass the immobiliser (somehow, don't know the exact science) by replacing ur ecu with a dummy one that they have. Hey presto, mobilised!

Dr Dave,

If anyone can give me thatchams number, i'll gladly pass on what i know. Surely then MGR must do something to change this situation as it aint good for sales!

@Don

The number for Thatcham I used today is 0870 5502006. I'm sure there are a few of us who would be interested to find out their response.

What system do you have running over the top, and on what vehicle?

Phil

OK, So whats the deal with getting you system upgraded, does it effect the warrenty if its not done by a MG-R dealer?

What about things like auto window shut and anti hijacking devices are these simple to install by a third party or should they be done by a MG-R dealer?

Is fitting a tracker a better option? Both insurance and cost wise?

Hi James

To be brutally honest, fitting an aftermarket security system to any car under a manufacturers warranty would invalidate the vehicle warranty, which, I think, is quite understandable.

Fitting a Tracker is a much more 'vehicle friendly' way of approaching the problem [or dealing with the aftermath:D should I say..]

Tracker has been fitted to many prestige cars at the point of sale (Audi, Jaguar etc..) so there can't be many problems there:)

The only downside of Tracker is the ongoing subscription charges>=(

To be brutally honest, fitting an aftermarket security system to any car under a manufacturers warranty would invalidate the vehicle warranty

Unless the alarm is Manufacturer Approved or part of their accessory range:D as per B*W

So its no warrenty or possibly no car. mmmm.. sounds like MG-R should go for a recall and get the problem fixed or offer a discounted upgrade to a Thatcham approved system that hasn't been hacked. If the insurance companies get hold of this one we can all expect our preminums to go through the roof. After all there is no point in having a security system if it don't work :( Might as well leave the car unlocked to save the damage when someone steals it >=(

You lot have got me very worried:~( are you sure that the warranty would be void if i were to get a third party alarm fitted? i was under the impression that the warranty was more concerned with mechanical components?

since my previous post i have spoken to the MGR dealer where i bought my car. They told me that getting a third party alarm will NOT invalidate my warranty:). This is unless i do have a problem that seems to have been caused by the installation, in which case it will by void which is fair enough. I'm not sure if this will differ dealer to dealer.

Yep, you're right to a point Oliver.....it's down to how each individual dealer views it.

Some are more tolerant than others.....I personally wouldn't have a problem aslong as the system was professionally installed :D

To all owners out there.....[James]....I wouldn't worry unduly about what has been said here....getting away with a car these ays without the keys [hotwiring] is very difficult to do 8)

Who is going to carry around a ZS180 ECU with them on the offchance and be able to fit it in a dark unlit road etc etc??

I think everybody is taking it too literally - don't worry...your pride and joy is safe outside!

Phil - I think you misunderstood me. I know WHAT the volumetric part is, what I need to know is WHAT MAKE the volumetric alarm is. :D

Dave - I presume the alarm system is the same on the ZT as on the 75? I can't find any markings anywhere!

Also, if it is Thatcham approved, do you know what category it is, because when I popped into the nearest dealer at lunchtime, they didn't seem to have a clue what alarm it has...

BTW, what is all this worry about the security system being bypassed.

To carry out the procedure you described with spare ECU etc, the thief would have to be SERIOUSLY determined and going for that one patricular type of car. This person is most likely going to be a professional car thief.

Car alarms will never be completely thief proof, and will only ever stop the casual thief/joyrider. A professional will just stick your car on the back of a lorry if he can't hotwire it...

Thats my point nick!

In brum, there have been reports of organised groups LOOKING for Z cars and then goin back for them at an opportune time. Yes its unlikely that they will take ur car, but i felt the duty to pass the info i have on.


Phil, i have a toad Ai606 running as well as my factory alarm on my 25. We tried the bypass of the system and it just automatically set the toad off- so the investment is worthwhile.

the old ways are the best at making sure that your car stays where it is

I like my Disc-lok. no fancy electronics just hard work to get the thing off(still 5 minutes attack resistant last time i checked). could also stick a auto-lok around the handbrake and gear leaver.

they surely not going to bother when faced with proper mechanical detterent.

cant do much electrically without being in danger of warrenty problems