Hi Gang
Happy new year to all!

I have a sad tale which i post in view of a warning, watch yourself if you test an RS Focus.

As some of you know i am based up in Liverpool and a do a small amont of work for JAG (Halewood).

I got to test the ST 170 Focus well before it went on sale and found it to be totally GAY! When challenged by my contact to bring my type "R" to Halewood i p****d all over their "test car". Indeed they couldn't believe how much better the CTR was to there p**s poor offering!

My contacts boss walked into his office 2 weeks ago, "Tell that MEGA that i am testing the RS Focus this weekend!" "We will see if he thinks thats GAY, the Jap loving b*****d!"

That weekend he go's to Wales to do a "Top gear", as you know it has an LSD. As with all LSDs it can grab the wheel and just coming over a bit of a dip it did just that!

We are not talking torque steer here, it draged the wheel out of his hands! and changed his flight path to the edge of a ditch. At which waiting was a Ye old tree stump!............BANG!

Totaled the wheel and load of suspension damage as well! The other RS that they where running with also had an off!

In both cases had it been a normal fast front drive i can only think it would have spun its wheels a bit! I see a number of posts on the BBs about this, JC was right, he was VERY RIGHT indeed!

You have been warned, be very careful if you test one!
Mega.

Interesting story! Yeah, most of the complaints about the car I've heard are centered around its Quaife LSD. And its something that both Ford and Quaife shout about as being a big positive about the car!!

btw, I moved the thread to Other Makes, as it seemed more apt there.

Yeah Clarkson picked up on this point during the TG test drive.

Scarey stuff, eh??

John

and IIRC 5th gear did not even mention it in their review :confused:

and IIRC 5th gear did not even mention it in their review

I expect they were on a backhander ;)

I don't care 'cos I aint gonna buy one!. But if I see one coming the other way I will pull over and wait for it to go by!.

You heard of cars being "licence losers", these are going to be known as "NCB losers" :lol:

LOL @ KA!

Thanks for the heads-up Mike - will avoid @ all costs!

EVo's car of the year article describes driving the new RS Fous as:

"...driving like your constantly having a two arm arm wrestle.."

Nuff said I think...

Isn't my diff similar to the Focus one????

Mines pretty well sorted, pulls you out of corners nicely!!! :D

NOTE for Mega:
Have you read the very unsatisfied Civic type R owner in Autocar???

I think, not that all CTR are like that, just like not all MGR cars have the faults you sometimes mention!!!! ;)

Ooh, and theres and good report on the SV!!!

Focus RS - Wouldn't touch it with a ****ty-stick.....it's not that spectacular performance wise, a close friend of mine picked up a leaflet on it and I wasn't that impressed....and it still looks like a focus, a car which I don't find particularly aesthetically pleasing to start with IMO :)

I think the concept of the Quaife system is superb.... but they seem to have done a 'talking Maestro' job on it i.e. launched it before its fully developed and de-bugged. The liabilities of fitting this system to the Focus must be seriously scarey:err:

John

Originally posted by JohnSwitzer
I think the concept of the Quaife system is superb.... but they seem to have done a 'talking Maestro' job on it i.e. launched it before its fully developed and de-bugged. The liabilities of fitting this system to the Focus must be seriously scarey:err:

John

now as i recall the SV comes with a Quaife LSD. Clearly MGR sees nothing wrong with them.

Yeah, but thats on a RWD car, the rear wheels don't steer as the front wheels do on the focus which is what causes the problems!

Rover Coupe and 200/400/600 and late 800 turbo (petrol) Models all have a Torsen diff which works the same as a quaiffe.
I think the BRM does too

It puts the power to the wheel with the most grip, round the bends its awesome as it pulls you round the harder you accelerate.

So really your slating the focus for something that cause the torque steer problems on std rovers turbos!

Jonny

I think the root cause of the 'problem' is people don't know how to drive a powerful FWD car with a slipper :err: :doh:

Johnny, the problem is that the Quaife DIFF is too sudden in the way it transfers the power from side to side. It also doesn't work the same was as the Torsen, IIRC.

A colleague of mine who is a petrolhead through and through and every bit as enthusiastic about Ford as I am about MG Rover had a drive in the Focus and even admitted that there wasn't something quite right about the car. In his opinion, he suspects that there is something not quite right about the balance of the car that is compounded by the Quaife system - as cornering hard on an aerial roundabout he described the car as feeling jittery, rather like the tyres all had very different pressures. Of course they didn't - but there is something not quite right here I feel. Everyone from Clarkson through to regional motoring jouranlists have commented on this.

Dave, even if it was (which I don't think it is) a case of most people not being good enough drivers to handle the Ford, then what the :***: are Ford doing launching a car like this into the marketplace and promoting it as a mainstream car?:err:

John

Originally posted by SteveChilds
Johnny, the problem is that the Quaife DIFF is too sudden in the way it transfers the power from side to side. It also doesn't work the same was as the Torsen, IIRC.

The Torsen is actually more effective the Quaiffe unit, the Quaiffe is more robust though.

Both are mechanical units and pretty much identical in design and function. Why do you have to remember, have you drove both? or looked at both technical drawings? Or just going off what you have been told.

You guys have to remember the Focus has 18" wheels! Also probably has unequal driveshafts.

If the test drivers of the Focus reviews drove some of your cars aswell they would make the Focus sound like a fluffy pair of slippers in comparison.

Go drive one you would probably like it- for me any car with 18" isnt going to be a B-road weapon is it?

Jonny

Originally posted by Mega

That weekend he go's to Wales to do a "Top gear", as you know it has an LSD. As with all LSDs it can grab the wheel and just coming over a bit of a dip it did just that!


YOur Civic has an LSD, the Focus has a ATB diff

LSD = limited slip using a viscous fluid

ATB/TorSen, active-Torque biasing or Torque Sensing, both as i say are mechnical diffd

Steve i would love to know more about this 'Quaiffe LSD' i was under the impression they didnt actually make a LSD?

Jonny

Jonny

I'm pretty sure that Quaife don't make a Limited Slip Differential and only manufacture the Active Torque Biasing unit. The irony of course is that ATB (as fitted to the Focus ST) was designed to ensure that there is no adverse affect on steering. Which is why I think the problem is elsewhere on the Focus. Certainly I am unaware of it gaining the same reputation it has gained on the Focus in any other application.

As I said in a previous post, going around a roundabout the car feels jittery and unbalanced and thats in normal traffic conditions - so it's not exactly being pushed.

Regards

John

Yeah Johnny, I'm going to try and blag a test drive of a Focus ST170 this week. Should be interesting:)

John

Originally posted by JohnSwitzer
Jonny

As I said in a previous post, going around a roundabout the car feels jittery and unbalanced and thats in normal traffic conditions - so it's not exactly being pushed.

John

Stiff springs? large unsprung mass ie 18" wheels, low profile tyres etc

Tarmac rally suspension aswell

deffo not the ATB though, no way is causingh the problem

Jonny

Had a test drive during the week, courtesy of my local, unfriendly Ford dealer. Gut feeling is quite simply that whilst this car is most probably a weapon on a race track, it is no B road racer.

A dream to drive on dual carriageway and the motorway, but just not suited to backroads. Plenty of power, a seriously slick gearbox with well chosen ratios, beautifully finished and a car that makes you feel special even sitting still.

But, as you quite rightly said Jonny - 18" wheels, super stiff suspension and a tarmac set up aren't very happy scratching through the backroads of Co. Armagh.

For reference, ATB is fitted to the JWRC ZRs and having spoken on this very subject this week to someone who has had the pleasure of driving a JWRC ZR, he has nothing but praise for the system.

John

A sad postscript to this whole story is that Ron Quaife died a few weeks back:(

John

Mega

I worked for jag last year (whitley) did youi hear about some guy who gave the Focus RS a right slating on a forum...

in short...some boss at ford found out and had him fired...

true story

:twak: