Carrying on from my previous 2 threads

1995 218SLD Turbo Smoke after Head Replacement...........and
1995 218SLD Turbo Pipe off Fuel Pump

I'm afraid I've still got problems.

I've reconnected the pipe to the black air box.....giving me much improved acceleration.....Thanks to all who helped.

I've had a diesel mechanic look again, at the pump timing and the cold start mechanism. Apparently he worked on this combination from the engine being cold(when i get the Combustion noise) for over an hour and thought he had reached a happy medium between the awful noise and the clouds of bluey white diesel smoke.

Unfortunately he broke his foot while working on the car(???) and next morning flew out to Spain......so i didnt get to find out what he had done to try to alleviate my problem.....but what ever it was ,,,,it didnt work, as i still have this awful noise on cold starting....its only there until the temperature gauge reaches half way.

He was adamant that it wasnt the injectors.
Major Ingram ruled out Low compression.
The smoke is definately fuel...not oil.
The pump timing was set with a DTI gauge....and the smoke filled the street the next morning.
The pump timimg was slightly advanced and the cold start mechanism freed(it was sticking), and the combustion noise deafened me the next morning.

I realise Ive already had a lot of good advice about this, but its still there.

Could the main clue be that it(either the combustion noise or the smoke....depending where the fuel pump timing is set) only happens before the temperature gauge starts to rise....It seems fine after the first mile or so.......It ticks over quite quietly and runs without misfiring.

Thanks in anticipation

Do you wanna buy mine?

Diesels are noisy when cold, of course.

Diesels are noisy when cold, of course.

I dont think it should be this noisey though....In fact i know it shouldnt.

Do you wanna buy mine?

I might consider a part ex.....but i'd rather you just gave me the advice to get mine back to where it was before the head change.

strange he broke his foot, and then went on holiday

strange he broke his foot, and then went on holiday

Yes I thought that........... He didn't charge me for the work he did, His mate rang me to come and pick the car up, and told me he was at hospital, and had broken his foot,.... when i enquired as to where i could speak to him, i was told he was "away to Spain tommorrow" I didnt really pursue the matter as i was hoping the car was fixed......And as it isn't....I'm back to square one.....

And of course, the family holiday was possibly booked and paid for

Has anyone got any constructive comments, or has this problem baffled even the wisest of you.......

Hasn't it all been said already?

It sounds like there's still some "adjustment issues" to sort out with regard to the cold stat and timing.

Hasn't it all been said already?

It sounds like there's still some "adjustment issues" to sort out with regard to the cold stat and timing.

Cheers Richard, I realise a lot has been said, and I've tried to pass it on to the guy who looked at it(but its hard to tell a tradesman his job)......He said the cold start mechanism was now working correctly(it was releasing).......Is there anyway i can disable this to see if it makes any improvement..... Before starting the car on a morning....could i for instance pour boiling water over the housing that controls the cable that adjusts the csm....in an attempt to fool the pump into thinking that the engine was warm.

Depending on which way round it works you could simply remove the electrical conector that controls it. I.e. if the cold start mechanism has a 12v when cold but 0v when hot then simply unplugging it will return the system to its "hot" setting. If the mechanism works the other way around i.e. 12v when hot 0v when cold then you could provide it with a temporary live feed to see if it helps the problem.

Most of the pumps I've see have the former method so simply unplugging the pump connector does the job.

It uses a cable from a waxstat on the thermostat housing - it either works or it doesn't work, simple as that.

It uses a cable from a waxstat on the thermostat housing - it either works or it doesn't work, simple as that.

Yes, it was that bit (the housing)that i was going to try and get warm, to see if it made any difference starting with the cold start mechanism in the "warm" position.

It also has an electrical connection as well tho, on the end below the point that the wax stat cable attatches to the csm .....could this be the 12volts E_T_V is talking about.....or is this supply for something else.....

That's the water temperature sensor, I think.

There are no electronics in the 218/418 fuel system.

That's the water temperature sensor, I think.

There are no electronics in the 218/418 fuel system.

This is definately on the the cold start mechanism lever.

This is definately on the the cold start mechanism lever.
At the engine end of the cold start cable or the fuel pump end?

There is the water temp sensor at the engine end and the fuel shut off solenoid on the fuel pump. But there is nothing electronic in the fuel system on that car (apart from the aforementioned fuel shut off solenoid)

At the engine end of the cold start cable or the fuel pump end?

Diesel pump end.

Fuel shut off solenoid - kills the low pressure fuel supply when you switch off and has nothing to do with your running problems.

Could it send a signal somewhere.....could it be a couple of contacts....closed when the wax stat has moved the cable and opened the csm, and open when it releases it....or the other way round.....and it transmits this message to somewhere??.....That sounds a bit double dutch...do you get my meaning....

Fuel shut off solenoid - kills the low pressure fuel supply when you switch off and has nothing to do with your running problems.

OK....forget my last

The reason most of my questions relate to the cold start mechanism, is that the fault(combustion noise or smoke) is only there until the temperature gauge starts to rise.....or dont you think the two are linked

Could you try disconnecting the cold start mechanism to see if that helps.
Indeed you could also try manually activating the cold start mechanism when the engine is running and cold to see if this changes the noise.

Could you try disconnecting the cold start mechanism to see if that helps.
Indeed you could also try manually activating the cold start mechanism when the engine is running and cold to see if this changes the noise.

I'll try and look in the morning to see where the csm starts and ends up. After ive noted the postions I'll try your suggestions....cheers

The reason most of my questions relate to the cold start mechanism, is that the fault(combustion noise or smoke) is only there until the temperature gauge starts to rise.....or dont you think the two are linked
No, what I am saying is that the fuel shut off solenoid can have no impact upon your problem - it would be all or nothing with a dodgy solenoid.

No, what I am saying is that the fuel shut off solenoid can have no impact upon your problem - it would be all or nothing with a dodgy solenoid.

Ok Richard cheers...I understand that bit .....that the electrical connection to the csm mechanism is to the fuel shut off solenoid(and wont cause my problem)......it was the rest of the csm i was going to try and test as E_T_V has suggested.

Forgive me if this has been suggested previously...

You say that the noise started only after a HGF?

any way you can check that the static timing is right? - could conceivably be that the timing (cam) belt is out by one tooth?

I think that has been checked already.

Forgive me if this has been suggested previously...

You say that the noise started only after a HGF?

any way you can check that the static timing is right? - could conceivably be that the timing (cam) belt is out by one tooth?

Hi Erebos....thanks for your input....but as the Major says, this has been checked ..........

(for Erebos)..."The noise is there because the pump timing has been advanced to combat the smoke that filled the street when starting from cold,(after the pump timing had been set correctly)"

I got my wife to start the car this morning.......when it was noisely ticking over, i pushed against the pump end of the wax stat cable(pushing to the left), and the noise seemed to lessen, I wasnt able to move it much, as i didnt want to risk damage to the wax stat end.

Been out and had another look at it today.....the reason the noise reduced a bit when I moved the mechanism was that I had reduced the revs a bit(dohhhhhh).

Being sick and tired of being charged £25 everytime the timing is checked I decided to get my tools out(UGHHHHHHH!!!)

Anyway, took all the hoses off and decided to move the fuel pump to a spot in between TDC and loud combustion noise...........HOW AWKWARD IS THE BOTTOM BOLT!!!...... Never mind....got there in the end, also fixed the boost pipe properly in position, and filled in the temporary hole I made earlier. Acceleration seems better again, but I wont know until in the morning how it starts......I hope its "less combustion noise"........but I expect it to be..."less combustion noise with smoke"....but we'll wait and see.

Re the electrcal wire to the end of the wax stat cable....I traced that wire back to the other side of the pump (which i suspect is the fuel shut off solenoid, Richard Moss mentions), where it also joins a wire from the thermostat housing plus another wire(which looks like a user added wire) from the wiring loom near the wiper motor..........does this triple connection seem correct, or has this third wire been added for a reason.

Re the electrcal wire to the end of the wax stat cable....I traced that wire back to the other side of the pump (which i suspect is the fuel shut off solenoid, Richard Moss mentions), where it also joins a wire from the thermostat housing plus another wire(which looks like a user added wire) from the wiring loom near the wiper motor..........does this triple connection seem correct, or has this third wire been added for a reason.

Hoefully(if ive read Bazza's instructions correctly) here's a picture of the said fuel pump with the single wire to the csm and the triple wire to the solenoid.....see the red wire at the front....that one looks "home made"

I assume that this is the Pug Diesel engine...

the thick red wire.. does it go to a blue box by the right-hand wheel arch?

if so, then it *could* be a repair job, my 418 has a wire in that location that goes thru the black flexi conduit in the same direction, maybe this went high resistance at some point and was bypassed? - I have an identical black, capped wire on the same terminal, plus another (apparently heat-resistant) wire that seems to be grounded/connected to the throttle linkage - this appears to be yellow and is routed around the pump.

hope this helps some?

*edit*
I don't yet have the peugeot diesel manual, only the 216/416 haynes OWM (only covers the petrol variants and haynes don't have a dedicated 218/418 manual in their catalogue) - so can't look in there :(
*end edit*

I assume that this is the Pug Diesel engine...

the thick red wire.. does it go to a blue box by the right-hand wheel arch?

if so, then it *could* be a repair job, my 418 has a wire in that location that goes thru the black flexi conduit in the same direction, maybe this went high resistance at some point and was bypassed? - I have an identical black, capped wire on the same terminal, plus another (apparently heat-resistant) wire that seems to be grounded/connected to the throttle linkage - this appears to be yellow and is routed around the pump.

hope this helps some?

*edit*
I don't yet have the peugeot diesel manual, only the 216/416 haynes OWM (only covers the petrol variants and haynes don't have a dedicated 218/418 manual in their catalogue) - so can't look in there :(
*end edit*

Yes your assumption is correct

The red wire seems to be attached to the green wire from the wiper motor....see photo

Re Haynes....The Major tells me he has HAD a manual for the 95 SLD Turbo.....so there must be one......I quoted earlier that Haynes don't list one........Ive searched and cant find one either.

Had a look in the manual I *do* have...

that green wire (assuming it has a grey trace on it) is a "live" (12V switched) supply from fuse number 13 in the passanger compartment fuse box, I can only assume that there *should* be a 12V feed to the diesel pump and that wire was put in to replace it.

Had a look in the manual I *do* have...

that green wire (assuming it has a grey trace on it) is a "live" (12V switched) supply from fuse number 13 in the passanger compartment fuse box, I can only assume that there *should* be a 12V feed to the diesel pump and that wire was put in to replace it.

Yes I think this is the fuel shut off solenoid Richard Moss talked about earlier........seems the "triple wire" is ok on there then.

Just about to go out and start it "cold" after yesterdays alteration to the pump timing.

Just about to go out and start it "cold" after yesterdays alteration to the pump timing.

It started "cold" this morning with a lot less noise, and only a little bit of smoke....nothing near the cloudfulls that used to come out...(Of course the mornings are warm at the moment....the colder it is the more the smoke.....so i'll tell you better in the winter)

This isn't the answer....its only disguising the problem......but its acceptable, if nothing elses prevails.

If anyone can read anything in to this that may cure the problem, I'd love to hear from you.....If not, I'd like to pay my thanks especially to Richard Moss, E_T_V, and the Major for trying to get to the bottom of it............and to all others who contributed to the 3 threads. I'm sure a lot of people will gain info from them.

Glad to hear that it's reasonably well sorted now.

Glad to hear that it's reasonably well sorted now.

Cheers Richard.....I'm still not happy with it....as I said...I feel ive only disguised the problem...not cured it.....

From the symptoms.....do you think it could just be that the fuel pump is worn, or the bearing is worn, and that the DTI gauged TDC is a bit irregular due to wear.........or isnt this possible.