Tractor syndrome... new solenoid or new pump?? - MG-Rover.org Forums
 
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post #1 of 11 (permalink) Old 26-10-2016, 14:37 Thread Starter
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Tractor syndrome... new solenoid or new pump??

I've got the dreaded tractor syndrome with error P1222. I can get a new solenoid for 75 from a local diesel injection place but he tells me that he's seen a few of these pumps (from Transits mostly) and says the timing mechanism inside can sometimes be at fault.

It's an 05 MG ZS with 82K miles and I really want to try to get another 4-5 years from the car if I can. So is it worth just going for a new pump? I'm worried about the pump ECU or metering solenoid going next, or maybe the turbo.

Any thoughts on how frequently these faults occur? I can stretch to a new pump if it means I can keep my car going but I don't want to be splashing out for turbo next month
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post #2 of 11 (permalink) Old 26-10-2016, 14:48
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It depends how you define frequent - it's a known issue of these cars but many of these are well in excess of 100,000miles, some have never gone at all.

So whilst it's common enough to become a known 'feature' of these pumps, it isn't that common itself.

Faults with the timing mechanism can in theory cause the same issues that a failed timing solenoid would - however I've personally not heard of this.

Personally i'd be tempted to try the solenoid, but obviously it's hard to guarentee these things. Might be worth checking it's resistance though and see if it's gone open circuit or failed in an externally verifiable way etc before splashing the cash.



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post #3 of 11 (permalink) Old 26-10-2016, 20:50 Thread Starter
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Ok, thanks. I'm just waiting for the diesel guy to get back to me on a pump prices. Rimmer Bros are 1200!! Presume the version of the pump used in the Transit can go straight in? But I think if it's just the solenoid gone I'll change it and hopefully I'll get another 80k miles out of it

Will check for open circuit.
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post #4 of 11 (permalink) Old 26-10-2016, 23:26
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The solenoid may be the same but the pump will not be. There are numerous VP 30 pump specifications for various cars. When my pump died on my V reg at 185k the ECU (PSG 5) had given up. I used a local diesel specialist (C F Parkinsons) who fitted a new pump head, ECU and solenoids for about 420 plus VAT. That was in 2010 and the car is still running to this day with 235k on the clock, nothing else has failed since so it was 500 quid well spent. I believe solenoids come as part of the new PSG 5 because the cables cannot be disconnected.

My other 25 has done 198k and is still on the original pump as is my 45 at 128k. VP30s are not that unreliable, but they do fail more often than mechanical pumps used to do. I am not aware of mechanical problems with VP 30 pumps, it is normally the ECU or solenoids that fail. Pump heads wear but they normally keep pumping adequately.

It is incredible if you work out how many pumping cycles have taken place in 200k miles and the speed at which it operates (close to 6000 pump cycles a minute at 70 mph). I think it is in the couple billion.
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post #5 of 11 (permalink) Old 27-10-2016, 09:56 Thread Starter
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Good to know you're still getting mega miles from your cars. I love driving my ZS and I can't think of another car I'd want to buy, so I'm hoping to keep it as long as is practical.
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post #6 of 11 (permalink) Old 27-10-2016, 18:00
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Good to know you're still getting mega miles from your cars. I love driving my ZS and I can't think of another car I'd want to buy, so I'm hoping to keep it as long as is practical.
Not sure how long Bosch will support VP pumps, or how long it will take for the spares supply to dry up when they stop supporting them. It must be a good 10 years since they became obsolete technology and replaced by common rail, at least by everyone except Rover!
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post #7 of 11 (permalink) Old 28-10-2016, 12:42 Thread Starter
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I've got a quote for 545+VAT for a full refurb (pump head, ECU, solenoids and testing) from DTM in Bristol, which is tempting as it means I can forget about the pump for pretty much the rest of the life of the car and no worries with future spares. Just got to get the pump off. It's booked in at my usual garage but he's moaning about doing the job... I'd do it myself if I had the time!
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post #8 of 11 (permalink) Old 28-10-2016, 21:02
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I've got a quote for 545+VAT for a full refurb (pump head, ECU, solenoids and testing) from DTM in Bristol, which is tempting as it means I can forget about the pump for pretty much the rest of the life of the car and no worries with future spares. Just got to get the pump off. It's booked in at my usual garage but he's moaning about doing the job... I'd do it myself if I had the time!
That is probably in the right order given I had mine done 5 years ago (November 2011). You have to put things in perspective, A replacement vehicle will cost much more than that and may then need money spent on it. I know plenty of people with much newer cars spending much more than this on rear suspension bush replacements and new front discs etc,

If you intend to keep the car for reliable motoring it is well worth the money, providing the car is in good condition, if you want to sell it for a profit then it is obviously not.

Finally, removing the pump is easy until it comes to the rear bracket, from then on it goes down hill badly. At least ZS/45 have decent space, 25s don't and the radiator has to come out, even then it is tight.

Good luck.
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post #9 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-11-2016, 10:21 Thread Starter
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Just a thought... I've had the engine remapped to 140BHP, will this be affected if I put in a new pump ECU?
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post #10 of 11 (permalink) Old 01-11-2016, 12:01
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Not at all



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post #11 of 11 (permalink) Old 22-11-2016, 12:41 Thread Starter
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Final update from me...

I decided the go with just the solenoid change in the end as the prospect of taking the pump off and paying for a full rebuild seemed too expensive and would mean my car being off the road for another couple of weeks. My mechanic was a bit nervous about doing it, in case it didn't work but thanks to all the info on here I managed to persuade him.

To get the solenoid out he went down from the top left, taking all the diesel pipes off and leaving the water hoses in place. When the solenoid was off he tested it with a 12v feed and it clicked a few times and then stopped. So it wasn't completely failed at first... worth noting if your going to test it while still in place.

He got the replacement part from the local Ford dealer for 150+VAT. Total cost of the repair was a little over 300. Thanks to Dakta and Bunny_Brain for the posts. My car is running sweet again and I'm hoping to get another 80k+ miles from it
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