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post #21 of 67 (permalink) Old 11-01-2017, 00:22
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post #22 of 67 (permalink) Old 11-01-2017, 19:41
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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
I am one of the most car savy driver/owners you will ever speak to.

I cannot remember the last time i lost money on a car.

If petrols were the best bet,id be driving one.Im not because they are not and not by a long way.

The only reason im involved here is because again i was being careful,buying my son a 1.4 Zr as his first car.A car that had covered just 28,000 miles from new by one owner for a few hundred quid wasnt to be sniffed at.Also Parts are almost for nothing,and we will make money on the car when its disposed of probably a year on.
You know as well as i do his ownership of the crappy petrol will be spent with his/mine fingers crossed knowing that HGF is very highly likely and ill have a head gasket to change although all steps to prevent it will be taken with a new rad,thermostat,and water pump.
He will also have to pay through the nose for crap mpg and cane it everywhere to get it going.
HGF, poor mpg,higher tax and being flat wouldnt even be a thought had i gone for a more expensive to insure diesel,but he will get a good diesel as soon as is possible and i will be able to relax my tools.
HGF can happen on diesels - they are not immune. It is not exclusive to the K-series, and certainly not exclusive to petrol engines. But then with your wealth of experience you'll know this. Apart from this weakness, the K-series is a decent engine but I feel the expenditure of effort explaining this to you may be wasted.

The whole petrol vs. diesel argument is one that gets continually chewed over, so I'm not willing to retread this muddy ground. The rate at which diesel engines have improved over the last 30 years has given oil-love greater validity, as has the legislative sway. Performance fans have been indulged by the French and Germans in particular with the development of high-output oil burners that seemingly offer little compromise.

We are learning however that this is not the case, as it turns out that the diesel emissions are killing people. This should not come as a surprise - how a fuel that smells so horrid and cars that emit vast black clouds under boost can be considered 'clean' is beyond any simple logic - but to many people, the pounds in their pocket matter more.

'Fun' is a very subjective term. The shove of low-end diesel torque has an attraction, but offers no fair comparison to the sensation delivered by a smooth high-revving petrol engine. It's like comparing an axe to a samurai sword. Both effective in their own way; one a blunt heavy tool, the other a delicate precision instrument. Guess which is the diesel

EDIT: I'm aware this thread has gone off-course slightly. Any news from the OP?
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Last edited by LeRich; 11-01-2017 at 20:01.
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post #23 of 67 (permalink) Old 11-01-2017, 22:34
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Thing is its the same people who informed us that all of a sudden diesels were horrific killers as told us we would get WW3 should we vote out of the EU.
Ive looked in depth at the 'evidence' and im not buying it.Nor am i stocking up on food cans for impending war.

I do however see the trillions to be made from pushing people into uneconomical petrol vehicles which of course are completely safe and do no harm.

If emissions really mattered we would all be running on lpg which is far cleaner than petrol or diesel but folk went for that only to realize when they had invested,they got duped.Ask Volvo about it,they were infuriated by being conned into spending millions on bi fuels only to find LPG prices were raised to nip that interest in the bud.
Dhl run alot of their trucks on it,but they get a 'special' price.The rest of us, its been worked out not to be cost viable.

Both petrol and diesel will run LPG.

Ive looked at all the options,ill stick with what ive got.A blisteringly fast car that can return 50mpg.

As for HGF on diesels,never had a single one and ive had diesels many wouldn't even know existed,some examples would be Horizon 1.9 pug diesel,bmw 2.4 diesel,rover sdi diesel,granada diesel.It does happen but people also win the lottery.

As for the OP hes probably looking for a petrol to get the sensation lol.
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post #24 of 67 (permalink) Old 11-01-2017, 23:30
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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
You think my 300 odd bhp,700nm of torque diesel car isnt fun?
Who mentioned "fun".
My day time drives have more hp and twice as much torque, I don't drive them for fun.
But they are less bland than the car you showed.

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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
You need to come out of the ninetys mate
Umm, where does that come from?
All the high power diesels I drive are from the last ten years including offerings from Merc and Volvo.

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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
Hey if you want a cheap car,Rovers are just the job.Keep you busy at weekends too
Personally I have never owned a Rover.

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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
I know you will miss me when ive gone.
No

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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
If it gets too quiet theres plenty of life on FB.
Where one can choose ones friends.
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post #25 of 67 (permalink) Old 11-01-2017, 23:35
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Originally Posted by Talkingcars View Post
Who mentioned "fun".
My day time drives have more hp and twice as much torque, I don't drive them for fun.
But they are less bland than the car you showed.


Umm, where does that come from?
All the high power diesels I drive are from the last ten years including offerings from Merc and Volvo.


Personally I have never owned a Rover.



No



Where one can choose ones friends.


lets see this amazing vehicle with 1400nm then?
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post #26 of 67 (permalink) Old 11-01-2017, 23:39
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"Who mentioned "fun".


You did!!

"IMHO diesel is for working, petrol is for fun."
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post #27 of 67 (permalink) Old 11-01-2017, 23:57
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lets see this amazing vehicle with 1400nm then?
Quoted from Volvo

Quote:
D11K330 (243 kW) * Max power at 1600-1900 r/min 330 hp Max torque at 950-1400 r/min 1600 Nm
D11K370 (273 kW) * Max power at 16001900 r/min 370 hp Max torque at 9501400 r/min 1750 Nm
D11K410 (302 kW) * Max power at 16001900 r/min 410 hp Max torque at 10001400 r/min 1950 Nm
D11K450 (332 kW) * Max power at 16001900 r/min 450 hp Max torque at 10001400 r/min 2150 Nm -
See more at: Volvo FM - Driveline specifications
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post #28 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 00:02
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Originally Posted by me
Who mentioned "fun".
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post


You did!!

"IMHO diesel is for working, petrol is for fun."
Ah, I see, when I said "fun" I was talking about non work, i.e. leisure time.
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post #29 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 00:15
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Originally Posted by Talkingcars View Post
Quoted from Volvo
Your class 2 arnt you,likkle stuff

Not that i have any interest in trucks at all.my only urgency with trucks is handing the keys back.A tool to do a job,like a hammer.
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post #30 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 11:19
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Your class 2 arnt you,likkle stuff
No, class 1, wagon and drag with crane, real work, not just tramping.
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post #31 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 12:10
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No, class 1, wagon and drag with crane, real work, not just tramping.
18 tonner you drive.You said it in another post so no more porkies!!

Not that its relevent to anything.I find truck lovers a little sad.
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post #32 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 13:27
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No, class 1, wagon and drag with crane, real work, not just tramping.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
18 tonner you drive.You said it in another post so no more porkies!!

Not that its relevent to anything.I find truck lovers a little sad.
I am flattered by your attention to my posts but with all due respect to your obviously vast knowledge but you are not in full position of all the facts on the subject.

The company I work for run a large fleet of several hundred vehicles from the smallest car based vans up to 44 tonne tri-axle tractor units and tri=axle trailers.

At the depot I work at we have
a merc panel van,
a daf 7.5 flat bed with tail lift,
2 daf 18 tonners, one with a hiab crane and tail lift, the other with a hiab crane and brick grab,
3 Volvo 26 tonners all with Palfinger cranes and one also has a brick grab
and 2 26 tonne mercs with hiab cranes, brick grabs and draw bar hitches.
Finally we have an 18 tonne flat bed trailer that can be towed by the mercs.

In the last 3 months the only vehicle I haven't driven is the 18 tonne Daf with brick grab.

And for the record, I am not a "truck lover", but I do use them for work.
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post #33 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 17:57
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Originally Posted by Talkingcars View Post
I am flattered by your attention to my posts but with all due respect to your obviously vast knowledge but you are not in full position of all the facts on the subject.

The company I work for run a large fleet of several hundred vehicles from the smallest car based vans up to 44 tonne tri-axle tractor units and tri=axle trailers.

At the depot I work at we have
a merc panel van,
a daf 7.5 flat bed with tail lift,
2 daf 18 tonners, one with a hiab crane and tail lift, the other with a hiab crane and brick grab,
3 Volvo 26 tonners all with Palfinger cranes and one also has a brick grab
and 2 26 tonne mercs with hiab cranes, brick grabs and draw bar hitches.
Finally we have an 18 tonne flat bed trailer that can be towed by the mercs.

In the last 3 months the only vehicle I haven't driven is the 18 tonne Daf with brick grab.

And for the record, I am not a "truck lover", but I do use them for work.


As for not being a truck lover,it was you that proudly tried to belittle my car berating more torque from your trucks.
As for ****ty ,wet and cold grab work,we all after start somewhere
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post #34 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 19:21
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Thing is its the same people who informed us that all of a sudden diesels were horrific killers as told us we would get WW3 should we vote out of the EU.
Not heard of any scientists reporting on an impending World War.

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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
I do however see the trillions to be made from pushing people into uneconomical petrol vehicles which of course are completely safe and do no harm.
Of course petrol engines cause harm; anything that involves the combustion of fossil fuels causes harm, be it to the ozone layer, the trees, the birds or humans.

I doubt legislation will push motorists back towards petrol cars. The ICE in any form is old tech. With its substantial reduction (or removal) oof tailpipe emissions, electrification is the next leap forward.

Government taxation and grants have encouraged the use of hybrid and electric vehicles for years and as such they have slowly become mainstream. Obviously once the aim of getting everyone into electric vehicles is achieved then the government will change tax law accordingly (they have to make money from motorists somehow) but until that point, they offer many benefits.

Whether EVs and HEVs are environmentally-friendly as they are made out to be is another debate all together (the emissions from electricity generation and the cars' manufacturer is conveniently ignored) but there's no doubt electric is the future. Diesel certainly is not.

On the subject of hybrids it's worth noting that the vast majority of hybrids are electric motors paired with petrol engines.

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As for ****ty ,wet and cold grab work,we all after start somewhere
Can we get this in English please?

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post #35 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 19:54
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Whats all this shouting!
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post #36 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 21:02
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Not heard of any scientists reporting on an impending World War.



Of course petrol engines cause harm; anything that involves the combustion of fossil fuels causes harm, be it to the ozone layer, the trees, the birds or humans.

I doubt legislation will push motorists back towards petrol cars. The ICE in any form is old tech. With its substantial reduction (or removal) oof tailpipe emissions, electrification is the next leap forward.

Government taxation and grants have encouraged the use of hybrid and electric vehicles for years and as such they have slowly become mainstream. Obviously once the aim of getting everyone into electric vehicles is achieved then the government will change tax law accordingly (they have to make money from motorists somehow) but until that point, they offer many benefits.

Whether EVs and HEVs are environmentally-friendly as they are made out to be is another debate all together (the emissions from electricity generation and the cars' manufacturer is conveniently ignored) but there's no doubt electric is the future. Diesel certainly is not.

On the subject of hybrids it's worth noting that the vast majority of hybrids are electric motors paired with petrol engines.



Can we get this in English please?
What on earth are you on about? Did you post on the wrong thread?

Electric mainstream? The only time electric vehicles were mainstream was when milk floats were popular.Electrics arnt a cost viable option for most,especially with the advent of battery pack rental.
There has been no real incentives to buy electric at all over priced and very limited.Hybrids are the same,slow,crap and expensive.Ok in London jams maybe but anywhere else just not a viable option.Many people would shudder at the thought of paying out 5-7 grand for a set of battery's so used prices dont hold either.
As things stand anyone doing any miles has to choose diesel and they do unless they are rich or stupid.I see no immediate change to that.
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post #37 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 21:18
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What on earth are you on about?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JT Dent
As for ****ty ,wet and cold grab work,we all after start somewhere
Same question back at you (again)

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Originally Posted by JT Dent View Post
Electric mainstream?
If a 3-series isn't mainstream then I don't know what is.

If you look beyond the black soot cloud you will see a proliferation of pure electric and electric hybrid vehicles available and on our roads. Only a few years ago it was a Prius or nothing. Now almost every manufacturer has an EV, HEV or PHEV in production or imminently so, most of which are based on 'regular' models so as not to alienate buyers too much. In many situations they are affordable too, particularly as company cars where BIK is king and EVs wear the crown. Monthly lease rates are higher than an ICE equivalent but then when fueling is so much cheaper this is often easily offset. Sure, EVs are not for everyone, certainly not yet, but like diesel they have the place and are increasingly more relevant.

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post #38 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 21:20
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Whats all this shouting!
Classic.

I seem to remember Tubbs being quite scared of "Satan's Black Wind"!

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post #39 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 21:49
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As for not being a truck lover,it was you that proudly tried to belittle my car berating more torque from your trucks.
How does that make one a truck lover.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JD Tent
As for ****ty ,wet and cold grab work,we all after start somewhere
I'm not sure how delivering clean new packaged goods is sh!tty, wet or cold, or for beginners.
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post #40 of 67 (permalink) Old 12-01-2017, 22:03
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As things stand anyone doing any miles has to choose diesel and they do unless they are rich or stupid.I see no immediate change to that.
Anyone doing any miles should notice the steady increase in electric or hybrid vehicles on the road.

And Shell are heavily involved in hydrogen fuel cell powered vehicle research and are installing refill stations at several of their bigger service stations.
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