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post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old 12-06-2017, 17:59 Thread Starter
CJJ
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TF to LE suspension

Has anyone converted their TF springs and shockers to LE500 ones?


I know the bottom bolts are different, but do you need to change top arms to accommodate the new bolts, or is their a work around?
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post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old 12-06-2017, 22:27
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I didn't know there were any changes, I used the TF bolts to fit the LE500 shocks on my converted F, not finished the job yet so can't comment further.
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post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old 13-06-2017, 07:36
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Are the bottom bolts different because the upper arm on the TF is threaded to accept the bolt and the LE uses a through bolt?
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post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old 15-06-2017, 15:36
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Apologies if I haven't understood the question. My 2003 TF has just been fitted with the "Factory Soft Ride Kit" on offer from the MG Owners club. They claim this is the springs and dampers incorporated in the last few TF's and then subsequently the MG Motor built TF's (excl the 85th Anniversary).
I spoke to Roger Parker before purchase and he said it was a straight "unbolt the old and bolt in the new" with no other parts needed. Jon Norris fitted it for me and he confirmed the method.

So I don't quite understand the issue with different bolts or arms
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post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old 15-06-2017, 19:36
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I think the difference occurred for the 85th. That had soft (05) front springs (green banded) with original (02-05) rear springs (red banded) and Bilstein (VHS spec) dampers along with thicker anti-roll bars front and rear with upgraded mountings.
This set-up was fitted using through 'dog' bolts instead of the original simple bolts due to breakage issues that we are all aware of.
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post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old 16-06-2017, 15:33
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Had my mechanic friend fit my LE500 suspension units to my 2002 115 TF yesterday. No problems using the original fittings. The ride is much nicer now, Cyprus roads do tend to be a bit rough.


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post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old 17-06-2017, 22:31 Thread Starter
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Ah, OK.


I think the new lower bolts were introduced to combat the old ones shearing, but I wasn't sure if you could fit the new suspension with the standard lower bolts.


It's good to hear you can and, as I haven't had a sheared lower bolt yet, I think I will just take the chance.
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post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old 18-06-2017, 21:39
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I believe that drilling the old upper suspension arm to remove the thread you can fit a stright longer bolt, 15 mm longer than original bolt. IIC the original bolt should be dia 12 mm, but this is the nominal dia,usually they are 11,92-95 so it would be fine to finish the hole with a rimer, to avoid any lash. But as you know the shock bottom rubber bush has a still bush that has to snap fit into the arm. Key point.

In such case you are not compelled to use LE500 longer bolt but you can buy high grade bolts or better Allen 12.9 or even 45H (IIC original are 10.9) it has to be stretched using the right torque according to the bolte grade, a key point will be the self locking nut. Bolt pretensioning is important.
The coupling steel bush/arm is in charge to bear the load, not the bolt, but if the bolt comes loose the coupling bush/arm will be no more so effective.
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post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old 19-06-2017, 09:25
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The bush definitely does do the work as the bolt to bush clearance is, er, shall we say, a rattling good fit! I believe the bolt is 12mm and the hole in the bush 13mm!!!

There has been a thread about these diameters and at least one member has 'shimmed' the bolt with custom turned sleeves to achieve a better fit.
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post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old 19-06-2017, 14:46
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I have a set of LE500 shocks and springs for my 2004 TF that I have not yet changed over because of this worry about shearing bolts.
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post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old 19-06-2017, 21:06 Thread Starter
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As long as the bolts are fitted properly, then I think the softer suspension is less likely to shear the bolts than the harder suspension. I always use new bolts and tighten to the correct torque, preloading the suspension.


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post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old 20-06-2017, 07:06
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Does it really need pre loading ? it is a bush that turns does it not ?

How do I know my torque wrench is precise enough ? Can they be checked ?
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post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old 20-06-2017, 10:53
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Preloading occurs when you apply the right torque, you stretch the bolt, using higher grade bolts 12.9 (orihinal are 10.9) allows you to apply more preload that is criticalin such cycling stress application-
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post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old 20-06-2017, 11:15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Titanium View Post
Preloading occurs when you apply the right torque, you stretch the bolt, using higher grade bolts 12.9 (orihinal are 10.9) allows you to apply more preload that is criticalin such cycling stress application-
I think what is being referred to is having the weight of the car on the wheels before tightening up the bolts.

I also don't think this is necessary where there is a spherical bearing which the bottom of these TF dampers have.

However, it is good practice if there are simple rubber bushes which could be locked in a twisted position if this was not done, eg F dampers.
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post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old 20-06-2017, 19:16 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete l View Post
Does it really need pre loading ? it is a bush that turns does it not ?
Does it turn freely? Or does it turn just as far as the rubber between the inner and outer metal tubes allow?
If it turns freely, independent of the rubber, then fair enough, but if by turning it puts a torsional load on the rubber then if you do not preload the suspension, the rubber part of the bush is loaded even when at rest. This can cause early failure of the bush.
I thing the bolt will clamp the inner metal tube while the outer metal tube is a press fit into the bottom of the damper.
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post #16 of 18 (permalink) Old 20-06-2017, 19:27 Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TipperMG View Post
I also don't think this is necessary where there is a spherical bearing which the bottom of these TF dampers have.
Spherical bearing?
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post #17 of 18 (permalink) Old 20-06-2017, 19:57 Thread Starter
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Just looked at the maintenance manual and the lower bolt refitting is about the only suspension bolt it doesn't say to preload the suspension.
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post #18 of 18 (permalink) Old 21-06-2017, 15:14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CJJ View Post
Spherical bearing?
Yes it's not a simple rubber bush. I understood it to be an inner sleeve that moved in many planes within the outer bush, hence 'spherical'. I will admit to not knowing if that is the correct description.

See http://www.mikesatur.co.uk/index.php...product_id=629
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