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The Inevitable... Head Gasket Failure

13K views 33 replies 17 participants last post by  alexinessex 
#1 ·
I thought I'd picked up a bargin and after 2 weeks of running, its far more understandable now.

I've found the typical symptoms, mayo on the dipstick, loss of coolant with no obvious leaks/drips.:cus:

Can anyone tell me how much I'm expecting to fork out for a HG replacement and fitting? You know what sparkies are like, "oh its gonna cost you"

I'd love to do it myself but don't have the time, space, tools or money at the mo.
To make things worse, I'm gonna drive back to Wales from Essex to see the folks at Xmas. Well that WAS the plan.
It doesn't seem too bad at the mo and the car is still running smoothly (apart from a bit of kangaroo juice at low rpm), so I was wondering if a dose of k seal would do the trick until I can get the money together after xmas?
What does everyone think? Brave or stupid?
:dunno:

Also, if anyone is living in the Colchester area and has the facilities to do the work, I'm sure I can come to some agreement.
Any help is greatly appreciated.
 
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#3 ·
I can't be sure but the 2 symptoms I've described are fairly give away aren't they?:dunno:

I checked all fluids when I bought it and no problems. Checked last weekend, no problems, checked today and no coolant, extra fries with mayo.

It tends to do a 1/2 hour drive each way to work mon-fri and not much at the weekend.

I'm on my knees praying it ain't a hgf but somehow I feel I may be spending a lot of money soon.:cus:
 
#4 ·
I just had my head gasket replaced by a guy called jason from dudley (i live south west london). he was recommended to me on here by someone when my head gasket went on my MG. He sorts out pretty much all head gaskets for rovers/mgs with the k series engines. He is a land rover technician/engineer and seems to know his stuff and can be found advertising on e-bay. he charges around £350 if you live in birmingham/worcester area. obviously a bit more if you live further away. cost me £450 which im pleased with as local garage was going to charge me a minimum of £600 and said that could easily double.

type in 'rover head gasket' in the search bar on ebay and look for a green sign saying mobile landrover services.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ROVER-200-400...ryZ10414QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
 
#5 ·
#9 ·
If your going on a long drive for Christmas, then do the following.

1, warm engine fully, and then drain oil, and change filter. id use slightly thicker oil 15w-40 maybe, and nothing more than a cheap semi synthetic. You will probably find at least an extra litre or more of mayo/oil drains out from the sump than the oil fill capacity.

2, Take off the bottom and top radiator hoses, and flush through the rad and engine as much as possible to get rid of some of the mayo in the cooling system. re-fill with the correct coolant/anti freeze mixture, and then add the K-seal.

3, Check and monitor your coolant level daily! There is a good chance that a car that is suffering HGF can be used during the short term, provided that the coolant level is maintained. If your still using coolant, then take some with you in a container when you go on a long journey. If the rate of water consumption is very high, for example you go from max level to empty in the expansion tank every day, then the chances are it won't run for that long, as the water that your losing is likely to be entering the sump, unless it's being leaked into the cylinders instead. If the level of diluted oil in the sump gets too high, then it will be almost impossible to start the engine, and if it does run, you could blow all the oil seals etc in the short term, and the oil film will break down, and starve the bearings of lubrication and eventually cause seizure.
 
#12 ·
Well, the k seal got me to Wales and seems to have stopped the loss of coolant (or at least seriously slowed it down). I'm gonna try and get round to giving her an oil change before the return trip.

A gasket replacement is gonna cost me more than I paid for the car by the sound of things :(. But it's my first car and I've grown really attached so I'm gonna have to fork out aren't I?!

Jason... expect a call in the next month mate. I've got some work for you hehe :broon:

Thanks for the advice guys.
 
#15 · (Edited)
Don't be so sensationalist....it's not radweld and isn't as bad as you say. I have seen the effects of K seal and have posted pics on this forum of a stripped down engine after it was used for a while and it does not block waterways or do any lasting damage.
Many people have had success with it and a lot of garages actually stock it and use it and so do the AA.
 
#16 ·
Many thanks to everyone who's posted a reply. I've recently changed job and one of the blokes I work with is a petrol head with the tools and garage. He said he'll sort it for me this weekend... phew.

I put my second bottle of k seal in about a week ago since it's started to enjoy a little tipple of antifreeze again, but this time the k seal has done diddly squat. I don't imagine it'll carry on like this for much longer!

As for the gasket kit, I understand you can fit the land rover ones? What am I looking for specifically if I ring around for some quotes? And would they come with all the gaskets/seals I need for the job?

Cheers again guys,

G
 
#17 ·
A desperate plea for help!!

Hi guys, so far I've been let down by those who have offered their help and this is my last ditch attempt at getting the head gasket sorted.

My local garage says they'll do it for £350-400 which I guess aint bad... trouble is, I don't have that kind of money.:wavecry:

Is there anyone on here willing to do the job for(/with) me (I'm on me knees and begging here) for about £100 maybe a bit more if i can get some extra hours at work (plus a few bevvies!)? I've got the parts just waiting to be fitted but no tools and working space.

I'm living in Colchester, Essex and willing to travel a reasonable distance (this is starting to sound like a lonley hearts column!)

Failing that, the poor old credit card is gonna have to take a hit at the local garage.:sick:

Again, many thanks to anyone willing to help. I can be emailed at gofres@gmail.com

G
 
#18 ·
re

ive got a decent mate who would do it for that price if you already have the parts , only thing is he lives in lancashire and that might be a bit far for you?
he works in a garage and has done quite a few k series hg and his dads lotus hg, it would be bad for the car to travel that far but its up to you. get back if your interested

stu
 
#20 ·
Advice

Hi,

I just wanted some advice about the head gasket issues that have been found on the ZR i have noticed a lot of them are on a particular series of engines. does anyone know when if ever this issue was resolved?

Im interested as im hoping to join the MG club and get myself a lovely ZR hopefully the 1.8 120 facelift model. ive been in a friends and thoroughly enjoyed the ride and have promised myself that my next car will be a fun but affordable car.

Any advice will be greatly appreciated!

Cheers :)
 
#21 ·
Welcome to the forum mate. Next time though, why not make a new thread regarding your question, instead of resurrecting a particularly old thread? :)

Anyhow, in answer to your question, this issue is unfortunately highly present in K-series engines, that is the Rover 25, 45, 75 and their MG equivalents. The ZR is the Rover 25 with a sporty MG facelift.

The issue was never resolved I believe, but once the head gasket HAS gone, upgrading it to an MLS head gasket with the head saver shim should prevent the head gasket from going again.

Good care of the engine essentially prolongs the life of the Head Gasket and its surrounding parts. This involves decent driving, checking coolant and oil levels regularly, and watching for the tell-tale signs, which are Mayo on the dipstick/oil header tank/coolant tank, overheating and sometimes loss of power or extra condensation/steam blowing from the exhaust. Also, checking the water pump for leaks and ensuring the Inlet Manifold Gasket is in good condition will help too, as these are both commonly assosciated with coolant leaks, causing head gasket failure.

Should the Head Gasket go, you're look at £350-£450 to have it replaced in a garage, though if you have the time and the tools, you can do it yourself for around £150.

Try not to be put off by any of this though. When the engine is working the 25/ZR is a truly fantastic car. I love mine to bits, and wouldn't change it for the world.

If you need any more information, there is plenty in the How To section regarding head gasket diagnosis and replacement, and alternatively, I'm sure there are plenty of others in the forum who would gladly offer their advice. Just remember not to be afraid to create your own thread, and always do a search first! You may well find your question has already been answered!

Once again, welcome to the forum.

Regards,

Glen.
 
#22 ·
Brilliant advice thanks Glen.

I was being a bit lazy if im honest regarding setting up a new thread, i googled it and this thread was the first that showed up so i just started posting haha apologies.

I've done plenty of research on the car itself and this is the only thing that is really slowing me down in selling my current motor to get something fun. all the zr owners ive spoke to love theirs to bits so i think the car speaks for itself.

Is there a general mileage i should be wary of when im looking for a zr? ive mainly been looking at sub 40k.
 
#23 ·
Really, just follow the standard rules of buying a second hand car: Aim for as low mileage as possible, remembering that the higher mileage, the higher chance of the engine having been ragged about and potentially a weaker head.

With that in mind, the K-series engine seems rather resilient to wear and tear over time. I got mine at 115k and it only just ate its head gasket at 125k. It's really not so much the age that does the engine in, more how it's treated.

The most important thing you should focus on in regards to buying one of these cars is make sure you get a full service history with it, preferrably including all receipts as mine did. That way, you'll be able to see what damage it has taken before, whether or not the HG has been replaced already, and if there are any trends in the car's problems. Don't be worried if you get a car that hasn't lost its HG just yet. At least that way you'll know that if/when it does go, not only can you have it uprated to the MLS gasket to prevent further trouble, but you'll also be safe in the knowledge that the head CAN be skimmed safely. If the car has lost gaskets before, whether or not you know about it, then you may find yourself stuck when it comes to having it fixed; the last thing you'll want to hear is that the head has already been skimmed to the max mark and that you'll need a whole new one!

In direct answer to your question though, I think it's all down to preference. I myself would aim for less than 70k if it was a car from someone I didn't trust, but others on here may be more or less cautious with the vehicle age. Just remember to give the car a good looking over before diving into it. It may have only 35k on the clock, but those 35k miles may have been the roughest miles ever, with the coolant never checked, oil never changed, etc ;)
 
#24 ·
Hi Neil,

I've got a 1.8 SE MG ZR 2005 and have had it for 2 years and guess what the HG needs doing. A friend of mine from the day i bought it has whispered in my ear HG every time he saw it and believe it or not today it was confirmed. Mine has around 36K and i knew that rovers are prone to this problem but never really thought it would happen with only that mileage but there's other causes of needing a HG. Correct me if i'm wrong anyone but bad design and original HG being crap is the cause right?

A mechanic friend had a look today and confirmed it to me and jokingly said immediately sell the car LOL ......... he knows i love the car and wouldnt want to do that so for an item that is not that costly to buy but costly to repair due to where and what it does its MAD.

I would recommend getting the car if you love it as once you have one youll love it even more. As mentioned ive had mine for over 2 years and love it to bits so wouldnt get rid of it even if it requires a new HG.

Does anyone know if putting a multi layer HG resolves the problem for good or is that a myth?

The mechanic did recommend changing the timing belt and water pump at the same time which makes sense. Living in London, garages are quoting silly ridiculous prices so anyone know anyone in London who does this sort of thing for a good price?

Help would be appreciated!!

Thanks,

Sanchez
 
#25 ·
hi Sanchez.

Yes, upgrading to the Multi Layered Steel gasket with the head save shim does tend to cure the problem providing that the cause of the HGF is fixed with it. Your friend is right to recommend the Pump and belt change too as the pump is often a repeat cause of Head Gasket failure, and both can be replaced easily when the engine is stripped down to replace the HG.

I'm not sure about prices in London as I live in Lancashire, so I can't help you there, but I would definitely recommend doing it yourself if you have the time, the tools, and perhaps a friend with the know-how. It will save you well over £300!

There are multiple causes for HGF, but the main killers for Rovers are the water pump failing, and the dowels that keep everything straight and flush with the Head Gasket being of poor design, and they degrade, allowing for some amount of play in the head, which rapidly wears down the head gasket. Most MLS head gaskets now come with uprated and improved dowels too, vastly reducing the chance of this happening again. Another common cause is the manifold gasket going, causing coolant loss, and eventually overheating, warping the head gasket, and potentially the head itself.

As I've said before, it's not the mileage or age of the car that really cause the Head Gasket to fail. It's the way it has been treated. Always check your oil and coolant levels in any car, but really check them in a rover. At the first sign of anything bad, start checking for other signs and symptoms. Better to catch it much earlier. It will save you a fortune!

Regards,

Glen
 
#28 ·
I am a big fan of the car and i do tend to check my current cars oil and coolant levels monthly and dont mind it, its hardly a hardship to suffer for a car that i know if i got id think was the dogs knackers.
The only other car i've spotted that i could get is the 2.0 clio sport, however, its french....need i say more?

Good look with your HG fix and cheers for the advice, i live in Manchester but know a guy who has a garage in Lancashire but he said that if i got one they would probably do the HG repair and replace all the parts around the HG (im presuming this being the belt and pump?) for about £350-450...if i remember rightly. Again cheers for the advice guys ill take care with what im buying cos im a pretty careful shopper anyway, need to make sure i get the right thing. If i get one ill be sure to stick a picture of it up on the gallery for you to admire :D
 
#29 ·
as stated somewhere above, head gasket faliure isn't purely milage dependant, my rover 200 1.1 that i had before my current ZR (went for an upgrade on the car i already had. :D) had covered over 140,000 miles on it's original head gasket, but my ZR has done just short of 69,000 and has just had a head gasket change.
rover was owned by an elderly couple before myself,
ZR owned by someone younger and had a full stainless system. :eyes:

just look out for signs of chav to see how badly the car was ragged.
 
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