MG ZT / Rover 75 - Diesel Tank & Pump Info

[Rover_ron]

Attached is a Pdf relating to the fuel tank.

The in tank pump is part no WFX100933 £185 + VAT

The under bonnet low pressure pump is WQB100482 £138 + VAT

Both in stock at rimmerbros.co.uk

Ron

Can this be made a sticky??

[COMET]

As a new boy, just to let fellow rover addicts know, the seal (8) was adrift in the LH saddletank and was leaking for approx two weeks and diesel was going down at a rate of knots. Have removed tankfilter and found it and replaced in position now OK. No special tools were reqd.

[MikeM]

Ron

Now stuck! Can we put it on the website also?

Regards

Mike

[terrymac]

Mike,
totally off-topic but I've got a PDF owners manual for the 2005 MGR VDO ICE if you think it could be useful to put up on the 75/ZT site?

[Rover_ron]

Originally Posted by MikeM

Ron

Now stuck! Can we put it on the website also?

Regards

Mike

Yes, Mike, help yourself.

Ron

[Rover_ron]

Its not uncommon to hear from diesel owners who break down on the motorway even though the fuel gauge is still showing about 1/4 full.

Failure of the in-tank fuel pump is relatively common and if yours is suspect, one way of telling is to keep the tank well over 1/4 full.

If the problems ceases, but returns if you let the level drop then this is a sure sign.*

Another sign is, if you rarely drive on motorways so even when the fuel level is around the 1/4 mark you have no problems, Then the first time you go on a motorway journey you break down once the level drops below 1/4 full.

My theory is this:
The tank is a saddle tank and fuel constantly circulates between the two halves. There are two level sensors and the pump is in one side, a filter in the other. When the pump starts to fail, this circulation stops, so the pump side of the tank empties first. (The under bonnet pump now doing most of the pumping) During normal driving, cornering sloshes fuel about, keeping the pump side topped up. But on long straight roads, the pump side empties, causing fuel starvation and because the other side still has fuel in it, the gauge reads okay. keeping the fuel level high, improves the chance of fuel sloshing about, keeping the pump side topped up.
When the in tank pump fails, the under bonnet low pressure pump can be damaged when fuel flow stops meaning you need both pumps replacing.

Another cause is a loose or leaking seal, or loose filter assembly, or just failure of the under bonnet pump.

Get you home measure: keep the fuel tank over 1/2 full, & carry a fuel can until problem resolved.

Ron

[MikeM]

Originally Posted by terrymac

Mike,
totally off-topic but I've got a PDF owners manual for the 2005 MGR VDO ICE if you think it could be useful to put up on the 75/ZT site?

Cheers terrymac. I'll pm you my email to send it to

Mike

[Speckled Hen]

Thought I would share my experiences on this subject. In February of this year my 2002 CDT Auto refused to start in Tesco's car park, after several attempts it did start and I was able to drive home as normal, however the next morning would not start at all, I had to have it transported to ex Rover main dealer EMG (Epsom Motor Group) Epsom, Surrey.
They diagnosed intank pump failed, and under bonnet pump intermittent fault. Their invoice was as follows.

RWFX100933 Pump-fuel tank £194.55
RWQB100482 Pump fuel £149.27
RESR3806A Ring-sealing £1.86
Labour £195.75
VAT £94.75
Total invoice £636.18 Ouch!!!

The worrying thing is that the intank pump had failed 18 months previously and was replaced under the Rover three year warranty. On that occasion I was able to limp to the main dealer at about 20 MPH. I wonder if anyone else has had this happen more than once, I wouldn't want to be saddled with that bill every 18 months, also, do BMW diesels suffer from this same problem.

[Rover_ron]

Originally Posted by Speckled Hen

Thought I would share my experiences on this subject. In February of this year my 2002 CDT Auto refused to start in Tesco's car park, after several attempts it did start and I was able to drive home as normal, however the next morning would not start at all, I had to have it transported to ex Rover main dealer EMG (Epsom Motor Group) Epsom, Surrey.
They diagnosed intank pump failed, and under bonnet pump intermittent fault. Their invoice was as follows.

RWFX100933 Pump-fuel tank £194.55
RWQB100482 Pump fuel £149.27
RESR3806A Ring-sealing £1.86
Labour £195.75
VAT £94.75
Total invoice £636.18 Ouch!!!

The worrying thing is that the intank pump had failed 18 months previously and was replaced under the Rover three year warranty. On that occasion I was able to limp to the main dealer at about 20 MPH. I wonder if anyone else has had this happen more than once, I wouldn't want to be saddled with that bill every 18 months, also, do BMW diesels suffer from this same problem.

Are you in the habit of waiting for the low fuel warning light to come before refuelling?

I used to let the fuel level drop until the warning light came on, but I recommend everyone to keep the tank about 1/4 full minimum.

I can only surmise that if the fuel level drops very low, the pump can draw in air, which wrecks the impellor due to lack of lubrication. The underbonnet pump then struggles to do all the work and it too ends up going the same way.

I can't see how else the fault occurs unless these pumps are just plain unreliable.

Ron

PS I also use Millers DPP which contains additional lubricants. At about £1 to treat a full tank of fuel, its a small price to pay. Also has other benefits - more...
http://millersoils.net

[icjoinery]

talking to an owner of a taxi fleet the other day and he has a 75cdt that has now done 290000 mile and we got round to talking of parts and he gave me this liitle gem, the in tank fuel pump off the peugeot 406 id the same as the rover 75 but has an extra cover on it. If you remove this cover it fits in exactly the same and cost about one quarter of the price!

[Speckled Hen]

Many thanks for your replies Ron and icjoinery.

Ron, I always try to fill up well before I reach 1/4 full, so I think I must have just been unlucky to have two pumps fail in such a short time. I usually fill up with Shell by the way. I will certainly take on board your tip about using Millers DPP, I searched their website and there are three retailers near me who stock their stuff.

Very interesting re the Peugeot pump, my brother in law has a 406 diesel which has done about 100,000, I don't think he is very fussy about when he fills up and I'm sure often leaves it until the light comes on, and has never had a pump failure, which makes you wonder if it is the position of the pump on the 75 rather than dodgy pumps.

[Rover_ron]

Originally Posted by Speckled Hen

Many thanks for your replies Ron and icjoinery.

...which makes you wonder if it is the position of the pump on the 75 rather than dodgy pumps.

I think its because the tank is a saddle tank - in 2 sections so it relies upon the fuel circulating between the two halves otherwise the pump side would run dry whilst the other side was still quite full.

[clean_shaven]

Following this thread with interest; My garage in is a Peugeot dealer and following interrogation they advised that they do, from time to time, have problems themselves with 406 LP fuel pumps in the tank.

However, we're going to have a look in the tank soon then he will give me a total quotation.

Mine's a 1/4 tank arse but I can feel it coming since I can detect a slight reluctance and delay in starting once I get to the 1/4 mark - it focusses me on finding a fuelling point.

Ta once again to Rover ron for making my car go vroom!

[Dr Dave]

In tank fuel pumps on 306 and 406 HDi's are pretty unreliable as we are seeing with ZT/75 platform cars.

Can't say I have ever changed one once it had been replaced though.

[sandbar]

Has anybody else fitted - or done any more research on the useability of - the Peugeot 406 HDI pump as mentioned above?

sandbar

[sandbar]

Does anybody have the Peugeot part number??

sandbar

[Dr Dave]

I doubt they'd interchange.......plus they're not cheap to do a trial fit.

[sandbar]

Post from 'icjoinery' - about 8 above - suggests that they do. I was just hoping somebody could confirm it. It would be a lot cheaper.

sandbar

[Dr Dave]

I could get access to a 406 HDi pump for actual comparison purposes but it might take a little time......

[sandbar]

Just a quick look at the catalogue for GSF Car Parts is suggesting that a pump inc sender for a 306HDI is £67.50. If that is the in tank pump - and the catalogue says nothing more than that it is a fuel pump inc sender - and there is a suggestion above that they are the same as the 406 HDI pump, then it may be worth pursuing.

In any event, it is giving a clue as to the sort of price a 406 pump might be!

sandbar