MG-Rover.org Forums banner

1 - 14 of 14 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
22 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Just bought a 2002 MGF TF 135 the previous owner says the cam belt etc was changed 4000 miles ago at 62000 miles but that was 6 years ago. It had stood in a garage for quite some time rarely being driven.
The car only has 66000 miles on it. I asked my local garage [who are very good] if I should get it changed & they have said the change should be done at 100,000 miles.....is that correct?
 

·
Registered
mg_tf
Joined
·
269 Posts
Hello Richard,
There will always be a time limit on the recommended change interval for cambelts, so the logic will be x years or x miles, whichever comes first. If your garage says it’s acceptable to run this car for another 34,000 miles on this already six year old belt, then it may well be worth asking them to guarantee this to be acceptable and stand the consequences if it proves to cause problems! Ok, pedantic, but...
Previous owner had belt changed 6 years ago - receipt? Make of parts used?
The x in ..x miles ...above is often taken as 5 years, so if were mine, I would be thinking seriously about getting it renewed, once you have carried out a ‘recommissioning service’ on the car, and ensuring you are satisfied with everything else.
If you do decide to get it done then to me, the quality of the parts used is very important, and if not using MG/Rover branded parts, then the only alternative I would consider would be Gates cambelt kits, but I would not use their kits including the water pump - I would source a water pump via. MG/Rover stock. Worth changing the alternator belt at the same time.
Kind regards,
Austin.
 

·
In the Garage
MG TF
Joined
·
32,849 Posts
The cam belt service for the TF is every 4th service or 60K miles depending what comes first. Whilst I feel that every four years could be stretched to 5 or 6, changing at 100K miles is too risky. In any case it's likely that the water pump will likely to have given up before then and the belt needs to be removed to change it.

If I owned the car I would have the belts changed together with the water pump.
 

·
Registered
2006 MG ZR +120 (HQM) 2004 MG ZR 105 (IAB)
Joined
·
9,163 Posts
The genuine MG Rover service sheets for the F and TF do specify 60 000 miles or 4 years for the cam belt change. However, the service sheets for the same engines in the MG ZR specify 60 000 miles/4 years for the VVC (manual cam belt tensioner) engines and 90 000 miles/6 years for the non-VVC (auto cam belt tensioner) engines, so i think there is probably more leeway to play with if you don't have a VVC.

......... if not using MG/Rover branded parts, then the only alternative I would consider would be Gates cambelt kits
Gates are not really an 'alternative' as they are the original factory supplier to MG Rover - the Genuine XPart/MG Rover K series cambelts are identical to the Gates ones, complete with Gates branding alongside the MG Rover logo.

What is wrong with the water pump in the Gates kit?? I would expect that this too is either a factory fit Airtex, or one of equal quality, and likewise I would think the tensioner in the Gates kit is probably the same INA one which was fitted in the factory or one of equal quality.

There are some other pumps out there which are certainly cheap and nasty, and I strongly suspect that a high proportion of the people who suffer water pump failures have cars which have needlessly had the water pump changed at the same time as an earlier cam belt change or head gasket replacement, and have been fitted with one of these inferior/cheap pumps. My own experience with the factory fit Airtex pumps (on non-VVC/auto cam belt tensioner engines at least) is that they are good for well over 100 000 miles. On the VVC/manual tensioner engines, there is more risk of over-tightening the belt and causing undue wear to the water pump seal, and a subsequent early seal failure.
 

·
Registered
2006 MG ZR +120 (HQM) 2004 MG ZR 105 (IAB)
Joined
·
9,163 Posts
Richard's - please don't take this the wrong way, but it would be good if you would start your own new thread for your queries and questions using the 'Start Discussion' button at top right of the forum thread list, rather than resurrect an ancient thread to tack your question on to - it saves people wading most of the way through the thread before realising how old the dates on earlier posts are, or replying to an earlier (x years old) post without noticing your new question.

This is the sixth time you've done it ;)
 

·
Registered
mg_tf
Joined
·
269 Posts
You are very welcome Rirchard.
Re...’....Gates are not really an alternative....’. Yes, they were original equipment suppliers to MG/Rover for new vehicle builds, but they were/are belt suppliers, and not cambelt assembly suppliers - tensioner might well have been INA for example, and separate contracts would most likely to have been taken out for these, and of course water pumps.
When MG/R set up contracts, it will be to their own specification which they will agree with the supplier, and this specification is almost certainly going to apply to subsequent bought-in stock for ‘spares’ sales. There is no guarantee that belts made by Gates as their own ‘aftermarket’ supplies will be to the original factory specification - and bear in mind that Gates never did manufacture the tensioners or water pumps anyway.

We can ask ourselves, why doesn’t the replacement battery from the original equipment suppliers seem to last as long as the original? Why doesn’t the second set of tyres of same brand last as long? etc.
Of course, there are far more examples, but hopefully you get my drift.
This is why, out of choice, I would prefer to go with a ‘genuine MG/Rover boxed’ water pump rather than an aftermarket one of unknown origin.
Incidentally - I think it would was the last Gates kit I bought - the tensioner was not an INA one as everything before it had been.
Kind regards,
Austin.
 

·
Registered
2006 MG ZR +120 (HQM) 2004 MG ZR 105 (IAB)
Joined
·
9,163 Posts
I cannot see how the belt supplied directly from Gates can be any different than what was supplied to MG Rover - both have the same markings apart from the ones supplied to Rover having the Rover logo printed on them in addition.

However, there is no guarantee that bought in stock now being sold as genuine MG Rover is either from the same manufacturer or indeed of the same specification as the original factory fit items - even when MG Rover was still in operation, XPart offered a range of what they referred to as 'Service Line Parts' which were a cheaper alternative to the original equipment parts, and of slightly lesser quality, even though they were still labelled as 'Genuine MG Rover' parts.

The original type SLS/elastomer cylinder head gaskets now supplied by XPart as 'Genuine MG Rover', are no longer the genuine Coopers-Payen that were the factory fit item. Currently all elastomer products supplied by Federal-Mogul/Payen are colour coded according to the type/grade of elastomer used; thus the genuine Payen gasket nowadays has blue elastomer beading, whereas those now supplied as genuine MGR are brown (and I have no idea who the manufacturer is). Similarly, if you buy a genuine MG Rover front suspension lower arm for a 25/ZR, you will no longer get the factory fit TRW manufactured part, but a cheaper pattern part sourced from Thailand (to be fair to XPart, it is priced considerably cheaper than the TRW item would be).

As to batteries and tyres, my own experience is that if you buy the from the same manufacturer as MGR used, and the same quality grade of product, they do last - tyres in particular I have never found any difference when fitting the same make and model of tyre as was fitted originally. Where they do wear quicker, I suspect it is possibly because the replacement tyres have been very recently manufactured and the newly moulded rubber is still very soft when fitted, whereas the factory fit ones will very likely have been in storage for a while before the car is used on the road (either stored waiting to go to a dealer, or sitting in the dealers yard/forecourt waiting to be sold), and this has given time for the compound to harden up a little and be more resistant to wear. I once had a brand new set of Michelin XZX tyres fitted to a 3 year old Ford Fiesta - the fronts lasted less than 8000 miles which I attribute to them possibly being manufactured only days before they were fitted and used. The replacement XZX that were fitted lasted over 20k miles.

Re. batteries; I haven't had a car from new/nearly new for long enough to have a proper test of how long a replacement battery will last - the last two cars that were less than 18 months old that I had both still had their original battery on them when I sold them at around 8 years old and over 100 000 miles. My current cars had recieved replacement batteries before I bought them - both inferior brands and inferior quality compared with the original Delphi batteries which were fitted by MGR, and both needing replacement almost as soon as I got the cars. As Delphi sold their entire battery business to Johnson Controls some time ago, I have fitted both with the highest quality of Varta battery available (Varta being the main battery brand of Johnson Controls), so I will have to wait and see how long they last - guaranteed for 5 years; one of them has been in for 3 years up to now.

Batteries often don't last as long as cars get older and pass from an owner who did a lot of mileage to subsequent owners who use them more intermittently - there is nothing that kills batteries quicker than lack of usage; it is very likely that it is the higher battery usage as a result of the higher mileage of newer cars which leads to the longer life of the factory fit batteries, rather than any future replacement being of poorer quality (nearly new cars which are little or infrequently used often need their factory fit battery replacing much earlier than you would otherwise expect).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
I have a MGF TF 135 VVC just bought & not sure when the timing belt kit was changed.I'm told by the previous it was done 4000 miles ago but that was 6 years ago....the car has been garaged for some time prior to him buying it.
He has no proof though so I think I should change it....bloody expensive but cheaper than a new engine I guess.
Should I let garage get the kit or buy one off ebay, if the garage gets it & it goes wrong it would be their fault I suppose.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,195 Posts
If I were getting a garage to do it, I’d let them provide the parts. If you get the parts, the risk is that if anything goes wrong the parts you provided would be ’at fault.’
 

·
Registered
2006 MG ZR +120 (HQM) 2004 MG ZR 105 (IAB)
Joined
·
9,163 Posts
I have a MGF TF 135 VVC just bought & not sure when the timing belt kit was changed.I'm told by the previous it was done 4000 miles ago but that was 6 years ago....the car has been garaged for some time prior to him buying it.
He has no proof though so I think I should change it....bloody expensive but cheaper than a new engine I guess.
Should I let garage get the kit or buy one off ebay, if the garage gets it & it goes wrong it would be their fault I suppose.
Why can't you start your own thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This makes it 7 times you have resurrected a long dead thread to ask a question not directly related to the thread subject.

A moderator very kindly took the time and trouble to separate off the posts related to your question the last time you added to this thread and made a separate thread for you, but you have ignored that and added to this thread yet again.
 

·
Registered
mg_tf
Joined
·
81 Posts
Man in the car is right, you should have started a new thread. I thought i was responding to the thread title "what noises to expect after a cambelt change" only realised it's an old thread and was resurrected to ask another/different question. Get with the programme Richard. ;)
 
1 - 14 of 14 Posts
Top